EMDR Remedy and Psychological Well being Assist with Susie Morgan, LMFT, BCETS

Betty Rocker (00:15):

What’s up, Rockstars Coach Betty Rocker right here, and I’m actually glad you might be right here too. Sooner or later, you could have heard me speak about a sort of remedy that I used referred to as EMDR, which stands for Eye Motion Desensitization and Reprocessing. And it’s actually identified for its means to deal with PTSD and traumatic occasions. There’s a number of totally different sorts of therapeutic practices on the market, and in terms of our psychological well being, it’s actually essential to discover a good match and the precise instruments for addressing our particular person issues so we will stay extra full and significant lives. After going by means of a very troublesome interval of my very own life and being recognized with anxiousness and despair, one of many suggestions I used to be given was to hunt EMDR remedy.

(01:02)
I’ll share a bit extra about my expertise with it on the present immediately as a result of the individual I’ve introduced to speak to us is the superb therapist I labored with, and I’m actually excited so that you can meet her. She actually helped me change my mind and my life. Susie Morgan is a licensed marriage and household therapist, board licensed knowledgeable in trauma stress, and an authorized EMDR therapist specializing within the remedy of complicated PTSD and attachment trauma. Along with her observe, she’s additionally an E-M-D-R-I-A accepted marketing consultant and coach, and the founding father of the Precision EMDR Academy, a boutique coaching company that equips and mentors clinicians to offer protected and efficient EMDR remedy. She is devoted to offering each a excessive degree of care in her personal therapeutic observe and advancing the excellence within the discipline of EMDR. I felt that she was uniquely geared up to share extra about EMDR with us and offer you a way of what it’s used for, who may profit from it, and what sort of issues it treats, and learn how to discover and vet an awesome practitioner. So be part of me in welcoming her to the present. Welcome, Susie. It’s so nice to have you ever right here with me. Thanks a lot for being right here.

Susie Morgan (02:22):

Thanks for having me. That is completely my honor, so thanks.

Betty Rocker (02:26):

Oh my gosh. Properly, I’ve been so excited to have a dialog about EMDR so that individuals would find out about it, individuals who’ve possibly heard about it could get extra aware of it, as a result of I really feel prefer it’s type of, it’s a more recent observe in terms of the therapeutic arts within the larger scheme of remedy. Is that right?

Susie Morgan (02:51):

Sure and no, as a result of that’s somewhat little bit of a false impression as a result of it’s actually been round since 1987. And so what meaning is that although it’s not as outdated as clearly like Freudian remedy and people actually conventional fashions or cognitive behavioral, it, it isn’t new. And so it’s, it truly has had loads of time to really develop out an extremely sturdy, like encyclopedia of analysis, not solely displaying that it treats PTSD, but in addition a spread of different problems that individuals can current with. And so it’s truly a false impression that it’s new, it’s simply newer that individuals learn about it and

Betty Rocker (03:34):

Newer that individuals learn about it. Properly, would possibly, like I ought to ask the primary query, which is, what does EMDR stand for and what does it particularly deal with? As a result of I believe that’s actually fascinating. It’s, it’s very distinctive within the therapeutic arts.

Susie Morgan (03:50):

Okay. So the, the inventor of EMDR would’ve renamed it. She stated if she had had an opportunity, however by the point it was extra well-known and being researched, she was like, okay, that is what it’s referred to as. So it stands for eye motion desensitization and reprocessing. And so let me break that down. So it makes use of eye motion. Historically, you should use different means to permit for the, the mind to mainly replicate what occurs throughout REM sleep, we predict so as to truly reconsolidate recollections. And so you should use different duties, different bilateral forms of motion with, with tactile and even tones so as to create this impact. In order that’s the attention motion a part of it. It’s utilizing this particular bilateral, units of actions so as to stimulate the mind to enter right into a reminiscence reconsolidation mode. After which the desensitization and reprocessing are the 2 issues that it’s doing.

(04:53)
What it’s doing is it’s taking the activation of those recollections and desensitizing that. So taking, taking the cost out of it, taking that chunk out of the reminiscence, after which it’s reprocessing it. So it’s truly connecting it as much as adaptive info and adaptive info. Is that this actuality primarily based or soothing or, constructive info that claims it’s over and actually undoes the training and connects it as much as what truly the mind already is aware of. However when a reminiscence is maladaptively saved, it doesn’t absorb the entire context of issues. It doesn’t absorb the truth that issues are over or that in actual fact, although you recognize it’s true, prefer it doesn’t really feel true. So it it, it connects all that up.

Betty Rocker (05:39):

What’s the eye motion a part of eye motion desensitization reprocessing? Is your eye simply going backwards and forwards otherwise you snapping your fingers? What’s taking place? Is there lights?

Susie Morgan (05:49):

So through the years, devices have been invented and since mainly the secret is you are attempting to have that shopper’s eyes travel throughout the sphere division as quickly as they will bodily tolerate whereas holding the reminiscence materials in thoughts. And so you possibly can have somebody, holding a, you recognize, a set of buzzers of their fingers that mild up they usually can look backwards and forwards between the lights. The buzzing can be an alternate that enables there to be a tactile degree of stimulation for that backwards and forwards in order that, individuals who can’t use their eyes for this course of truly can have an efficient type of bilateral stimulation. There are eye, like, like eye motion machines the place mainly you possibly can, you possibly can observe a lightweight bar backwards and forwards, or there’s like these containers you possibly can maintain that may trigger your lights to return, trigger your eyes to travel as you observe the lights.

(06:49)
There are laptop applications which have somewhat bouncing ball that travel, however backside line is you don’t want machines. You simply want some mechanism for eyes to travel. So I do, I do EMDR on-line on a regular basis now with none equipment in any way, with none particular applications. I simply have individuals pinching their fingers backwards and forwards with their eyes held a couple of shoulder width aside. They observe their very own pinches, and that produces the efficient eye motion. However mainly what we’ve proven in analysis is that eye motion is the simplest solution to create the reminiscence reconsolidation course of that we’re in search of. Nonetheless, these different strategies tactile and, an auditory can produce an analogous degree, however there does appear to be greater than, extra at play than simply that your eyes are going backwards and forwards. There’s, there’s the likelihood that that’s, activating a rem like mechanism of sleep.

(07:48)
We see chemical, chemical, comparable chemical compounds produced within the mind, comparable brainwaves. It additionally seems that work taxing working reminiscence is among the explanation why it’s efficient. It’s not as comfy, it’s not as enjoyable to have to really like, like do a flowery patterning along with your fingers whilst you have the buzzing or matching your eye actions along with your pinches. However that truly causes the troublesome reminiscence materials to metabolize sooner. However should you overtax working reminiscence, you lower on that reprocessing portion. So it’s, there’s type of a candy spot, and it’s totally different for every individual on how a lot, how laborious we would like them to work whereas they’re doing the bilateral processing.

Betty Rocker (08:35):

What’s a, what’s an excellent instance of a maladaptive reminiscence that somebody may need that was not connecting? Proper? Or what occurs in, in remedy?

Susie Morgan (08:46):

So an instance of a, a trauma reminiscence can be a canine chunk. So somewhat woman, she’s in her entrance yard, A canine comes by, bites her. There’s two methods the mind can go together with that. One we’d name maladaptive. One we’d name adaptive. And so it, it, and the distinction is how does the reminiscence find yourself being saved by the mind, which components of the mind are concerned? And so if it’s maladaptively saved, it will get at, it will get saved in virtually like this unique kind. Like the entire, the visible sight sounds feels of that second are identical to encapsulated in time. And so she could be 30 years outdated and it feels prefer it occurred yesterday when she thinks of it. So it, it shops scorching within the visible cortex of the mind, the emotional cortex of the mind. And the fascinating factor is the logical components of the mind that claims it’s over, you’re protected now. That type of factor. The, that complete piece of the mind doesn’t even come on-line. So it’s all sight sounds, feels, and feelings, and it’s scorching and it’s saved that method reasonably than it’s over, I’m protected. It occurred a very long time in the past. Now I do know that, you recognize, you need to, you recognize, type of just be sure you don’t simply pet a canine. You don’t know , that type of factor,

Betty Rocker (10:10):

Proper? So, so the expertise that an individual would have who had these two totally different storages of the reminiscence is one little woman may be afraid of canine endlessly as a result of that reminiscence’s at all times burning vibrant and burning scorching with all of that saved stuff the place the opposite little woman who’s,  it’s not saved in a unfavorable method. She simply is extra cautious in approaching canine the place the opposite woman may be afraid to strategy a canine in that sense. Yeah. So the, the trauma impacts how we behave in several methods transferring ahead is what you’re saying

Susie Morgan (10:40):

In that type of adaptive versus maladaptive piece. Adaptive is, I’m protected now on a really fundamental degree and I can maintain myself protected now, or it’s, I’m not protected. And so the physique goes in a struggle or flight, if something reminds the nervous system of that incident. And there’s truly three forms of trauma I consider that actually, actually matter. And so it’s very a lot increasing out the definition of the phrase in a, in a method that I believe is essential as a result of there’s so many individuals who say, nicely, I don’t have trauma. I wasn’t at warfare, I wasn’t assaulted, that type of factor. So, so EMDR remedy isn’t for me or considering of myself as having trauma that I would want to reprocess by means of that might be affecting my signs.  That simply doesn’t, that simply doesn’t come of their conceptualization

Betty Rocker (11:30):

Certain.

Susie Morgan (11:31):

Of what they’re coping with, and subsequently it stops them from getting assist they might get. So the three forms of trauma that I believe are actually essential to grasp are that huge T trauma. In order that’s classically what we perceive as, yeah, blood hearth warfare assault, that’s what that’s conceptualized as. Then you might have, little t traumas or what are opposed life occasions. And these are issues that usually individuals, you recognize, another person may take a look at that and be like, nicely, that’s no huge deal. So that is like bullying. Or it’s issues like, you recognize, somebody, somebody being a jerk at work or somebody calling you a reputation on the playground or your sister leaving you out, like that type of factor. So, so these are your little, little to your opposed life occasions. However truly what’s much more crucial, I believe, is knowing complicated with complicated, developmental trauma, which is extra widespread than you may assume, is when early attachment wants aren’t met.

(12:32)
And, or then if there’s additionally some abuse or issues like that in these early years that it, that’s actually truly what can create the longest and most pervasive points with anxiousness, despair, all types of issues that we simply consider like, oh, these are psychological well being points, when truly, if we return, we’re trying on the absence of attunement and even the absence of play, which is fascinating. The absence of safety. This, you recognize, simply not having the steering you want, like learn how to shave your legs, learn how to take care of a, a bully peer. Like all of those totally different items actually make a distinction within the means of that individual’s nervous system to face up to the stressors that may come. And so oftentimes when these type of developmental early attachment wants aren’t met, then you might have extra of a, of a susceptibility for the mind to maladaptively maintain these later occasions. So it’s, it’s actually tough.

Betty Rocker (13:38):

Properly, not, I believe you defined it superbly in order that the three sorts, there’s the large Ts, there’s the, the little ts, that are, what did you name them? Adversarial occasions. After which there’s additionally the attachment points. And, and attachment principle is totally fascinating. I keep in mind that you beneficial the e book connected to me years in the past, and it was so useful in a, a, giving me a framework of understanding the distinction between the, anxious avoidant and the safe attachment types, that are these three attachment types. And simply saying them, it, it makes a lot sense why anxious and avoidant can be so polarized should you guys take into consideration that. It’s so fascinating. After which how will we create safety, proper? And, and totally different facets of our life. However, that was, that was actually fascinating that that comes into play in, in what’s handled throughout the scope of EMDR. We wanna speak somewhat bit extra about that. ’trigger I believe that’s so fascinating.

Susie Morgan (14:41):

Yeah, I’d like to as a result of it’s, it’s a lot what is available in to the workplace when individuals are saying, my relationships are simply not working mm-hmm . Or I maintain entering into the identical sort of type of damaging dynamic with my companions. Mm. And so, so what occurs when these early attachment wants aren’t met is somewhat nervous system is so good and so smart to type of learn the room of the connection with their caregivers, they usually truly can learn the room in a different way with totally different caregivers relying on what, what will probably be handiest for his or her must be met. And, and to contextualize this, little mammals can’t survive with out their caregivers attunement to them or their, not attunement, however with out them assembly their wants. Mainly. Like little mammals die if their caregiver type of leaves them by the aspect of the highway with out issues. And so people are not any totally different.

(15:40)
And so an toddler or a toddler or issues like that may understand if I cry extra, you come, if I cry much less, you don’t get so mad at me. That type of factor. Mm-hmm. And so what finally ends up taking place whenever you simply take a look at anxious versus avoidant anxious is, I cry extra, you’ll come mm-hmm. Avoidant is, I cry much less, I’m extra prone to get my wants met, I’m safer right here. After which you might have these very unhappy conditions the place the, the early setting is so harsh and is so each neglectful of those attachment wants in addition to damaging by means of abuse or issues like that, that the nervous system will study. Like, okay, generally I cry louder, generally I shut down. Prefer it’s this complete like, like dance of simply to attempt to get wants met in no matter little tiny method that they will. And the factor is, as soon as the mind locks in on this stuff, identical to trauma recollections, as soon as the mind locks in on these attachments methods or these variations to their en their early setting ring retains doing the identical factor over and again and again, whether or not or not the setting modifications.

(16:49)
And finally the saddest half that I see in my, in my workplace is little nervous methods as they develop up, select most naturally what looks like dwelling. And they also’ll repeat what they, they went by means of after they had been small, considering they’re doing one thing totally different, however then touchdown in the identical sort of of relationship. After which, after which concluding, I’m the issue. It’s as a result of I’m nugatory, I’m unlovable, or regardless of the case may be. When finally, like that isn’t the case. It’s actually simply that their nervous system doesn’t know learn how to do one thing totally different. In order that’s the actually cool stuff we will do with superior expertise with EMDR remedy isn’t just remedy these recollections. Like we don’t simply reprocess recollections. We truly can truly restore and restore the attachment system. So it’s, it’s fairly magic what’s doable and

Betty Rocker (17:44):

All of that, whether or not you might be treating trauma, reminiscence or attachment that’s gotten, it’s, I’m simply picturing like a rug that acquired all bunched up and Proper. It’s not, it’s not clean, whether or not you’re treating any of these various things, the, the first final result is a way of safety, a way of security within the self, a way of self that’s mm-hmm . Protected and complete and, and sufficient, proper. For therefore many people who, who, you recognize, search remedy. One factor that I’ve been studying quite a bit recently, and it’s so unusual as a result of we had been gonna have this dialog and I wished to ask you about it. How do we all know that the remedy that we’re doing is correct for us? That’s undoubtedly a query. And, and two, like, why is it that there’s a lot remedy that simply doesn’t appear to work, I suppose like, yeah, what’s occurring with that?

Susie Morgan (18:41):

So a number of the rationale why remedy doesn’t work is as a result of it doesn’t truly change the way in which the nervous system is working. And so what you’re doing is you’re utilizing actually what, what could be actually highly effective instruments, but it surely’s extra like manually shifting a automobile reasonably than having driving an automated, mainly the place it’s a must to use these expertise so as to shift the mind into that adaptive functioning. So one of many issues that I believe is admittedly, actually essential for, for EMDR therapists to grasp learn how to do, and it hasn’t been historically skilled, however is to actually be capable of map out what are the first trauma reminiscence networks, the methods the mind has clustered collectively numerous experiences, after which is working out of those maladaptive beliefs. So that you’ll have that canine chunk, however then now mother is, you recognize, mother is late choosing you up from daycare, and one way or the other the mind goes, yep, I’m not protected once more.

(19:44)
Otherwise you stroll by a barking canine, who’s actually scary on the way in which to soccer observe, and the mind goes, yep, not protected once more. After which it, it’s mainly placing all these recollections collectively right into a cluster and saying, right here’s my proof of idea, I’m not protected. After which something that triggers that trauma, reminiscence community, lights up all of that cluster of experiences, after which the nervous system responds to that. So oftentimes a, a shopper who is available in has a number of clusters, in order that they have one cluster proving I’m not protected. Perhaps one other cluster saying I’m unlovable, one other cluster saying I don’t belong, or no matter it’s. Like it may be any number of these. And so if now we have that lay of the land, that may be actually useful for us realizing, okay, this, this, I’m not protected is linked to those panic signs, or this, I’m not lovable, is linked to those attachment type of anxious attachment sort methods, regardless of the case may be.

(20:44)
However then now we have this different superb reminiscence community that each one of us have. It’s only for a few of us, it’s, it’s extra nicely developed than others. And it’s the adaptive info community. It’s all these experiences of, of, you recognize, studying or of being cherished or of being restored ultimately, or having, you recognize, a way of belonging as a part of a tradition or a part of a, you recognize, a part of a spiritual observe or a part of a, of a non secular group. These, these finest buddies or these, these animals that simply love us it doesn’t matter what. All of that. And I consider these as bushes. So so mainly there’s, there’s one thing that planted the tree when it comes to the, these darkish trauma reminiscence networks. There’s an occasion that planted the tree, after which the tree simply grew up and acquired greater with all of these different occasions that acquired clustered collectively.

(21:37)
Properly, this, this mild tree, this adaptive info tree of knowledge additionally has, has a method wherein it was planted. That’s that early attachment system. In order that’s the trunk of that tree. And a few individuals have a spindly trunk, which implies they’re way more inclined to the wind blowing after which being taken off steadiness. After which in addition they can have numerous ranges of levels wherein that adaptive info community has been constructed out by all of those different constructive and experiences of resilience, experiences of success, experiences of overcoming all that jazz, so, so lengthy solution to, to put the inspiration for the reply to your query is mainly therapies, I believe do one among two issues. One is they assist improve that mild tree of adaptive info. So whenever you’re studying meditation, whenever you’re studying how to consider the constructive, learn how to deal with what’s true about you, all of that, you’re actually enhancing and specializing in that adaptive info reminiscence community.

(22:45)
And, and so there’s a lot that’s constructive and highly effective about a number of the therapies on the market that try this. Then there’s one other, type of sort of remedy like cognitive behavioral, the place what it’s doing is it’s, it’s permitting you to problem that activation of that unfavorable reminiscence community and saying, yeah, however keep in mind it’s not true. And so that you try this, that guide shifting by means of type of logic your self into the sunshine tree. However that’s actually laborious and might really feel like gaslighting actually, whenever you’re like, however my nervous system says the trauma is what’s true. Not this different logic stuff that I would know in my head.

Betty Rocker (23:28):

That simply is a part of what I suppose I’ve been listening to from individuals generally after they say, you recognize, speak remedy or sure forms of speak remedy, I really feel like I’m simply rehashing these uncomfortable issues time and again with out actually getting anyplace. I’m simply spinning my wheels.

Susie Morgan (23:41):

That’s one other sort of remedy. So there’s, there are forms of remedy the place the concept is that if now we have perception or if we speak sufficient by means of it, you then’ll get higher. So meaning you sit at nighttime hint, you sit in these trauma reminiscence networks throughout trauma, the, throughout your remedy, and that’s speculated to theoretically make you’re feeling higher, but it surely doesn’t truly essentially try this as a result of all you’re doing is type of dwelling within the darkness. And so individuals are like, nicely, I don’t wanna go to my previous. I wanna do these different issues. Properly, that’s nice. Now all you’re doing is manually shifting into the lightness. So what we’re in search of is one thing that truly reconsolidate the reminiscence truly shifts the, the, the, the training that’s occurred within the nervous system. And EMDR just isn’t the one present on the town that may try this. There are different therapies that truly could be efficient with reminiscence. Reconsolidation, EMDR remedy is only one the place we do get constant outcomes with that when it’s achieved correctly. And in order that’s, yeah.

Betty Rocker (24:42):

That’s, that’s the R and the EMDR, the reprocessing half. Sure. Yeah, that’s the place the mixing occurs. So I’ll share somewhat bit, that, you recognize, however my listeners don’t. Once I first began doing EMDR remedy with Susie, it’s been a number of years now since we did this nice work collectively, and we spent a few years doing it. I keep in mind at first I used to be like, nicely, when are we, when will we get to do the EMDR? Like, when are we gonna get to that half? And what was actually superb is her strategy was so considerate. She was, she went in and discovered the place now I do know the lingo, after all I didn’t on the time, my clusters, she was in search of the place are the, the networks right here that I must work with. She deliberately discovered the panorama of this thoughts that she was then going to be going into with like her advantageous devices and serving to to reprocess.

(25:38)
Proper? So like, that was such an essential a part of that work. I believe that, that should you don’t learn about it, you, you don’t know what you don’t know, proper? However I believe it’s so essential. And there’ve been, and there have been additionally issues that you simply did at first that I’ve by no means forgotten. You gave me instruments. I keep in mind a few of the superb instruments that you simply gave me to assist me have a way of safety, to have a way of security. After which after all, the precise observe of EMDR, which is so superb. It’s so troublesome to do the work generally, but it surely’s additionally so essential. It’s like, you recognize, you guys, like whenever you do a very robust exercise, , such as you gotta put within the work to get the end result. However it felt like there was a real final result coming whilst I used to be going by means of the troublesome facets of it.

(26:26)
And it, it, I used to attempt to clarify what it was love to do, to be an a, a affected person going by means of E-M-D-R, should you guys have seen the film “Inside Out,” that is like the easiest way that I can clarify it. There’s this place that, that they go what’s, which is just like the reminiscence financial institution, and it’s all of those glowing balls of sunshine that they’ve simply stacked up and stacked up and stacked up. And so I at all times pictured just like the trauma recollections as like these like gnarly black balls of sunshine that, that had been like saved within the reminiscence financial institution, that, that had been truly infecting all the opposite recollections. As a result of that’s what occurs along with your, with the issues which might be what we name maladaptive. Right. Is that proper terminology? Yeah. So the maladaptive recollections that didn’t truly get processed appropriately at first, these are like now infecting the remainder of your recollections.

(27:14)
And so you might have these reactions to issues you could’t actually management. It’s like bugs in your working system if you’d like like a pc terminology for it. And it was like going by means of doing the work of the EMDR, you’re like altering the material again to one thing clean. We will return to that rug instance the place the rug was all bunched up and we’re like smoothing out the rug. And now when one thing comes up that was once an actual set off or one thing that may, you’ll have like this unavoidable response that you simply had no management over, it’s not there, it’s simply not even a set off. You continue to have the reminiscence of the factor, but it surely’s not lit up anymore. And I believe that was so profound for me of just like the expertise of EMDR, of like how a lot it modified the material of my precise being.

(27:58)
Like I felt like I turned just like the model of myself. I used to be at all times meant to be by means of going by means of that work. And so it makes a number of sense. This care that’s taken all through the method, particularly at first, as a result of I’ve had buddies inform me – oh why, when – I’ve despatched buddies to EMDR they usually’re like why when do I get to do the EMDR? I’m like, let your therapist do these actually essential items at first as a result of they’re going to provide help to get a greater lead to the long run. So I believe it’s fascinating the way it

Susie Morgan (28:32):

Works. There’s so many items that you simply simply stated which might be so essential that I wanna virtually give the again of the home understanding of a bit. Please, please. The, the why. In order that unique query you requested of like, nicely, how have you learnt should you’re in the precise place along with your therapist? Yeah. And I believe there’s that bigger query of like, are you doing a remedy that truly modifications the way in which the nervous system is holding the recollections? And, so that you’re re transforming that complete factor so that you routinely reply in a different way. It’s not that guide management, however whenever you’re searching for out an EMDR therapist, whether or not or not they take this, this primary like part of the work actually significantly is a very huge element for deciding whether or not or not you’re in the precise place.

Betty Rocker (29:22):

Mm.

Susie Morgan (29:22):

And oftentimes, this isn’t the fault of the therapist, it’s the fault of the way it’s historically been skilled the place actually it’s such as you do type of like this, this fast, this fast intro and you then simply soar into, to processing trauma recollections. However that’s the place now we have individuals having actually unhealthy experiences. And the primary purpose is as a result of individuals, individuals aren’t essentially prepared for that but. And or the, the therapist doesn’t essentially have the, the readiness of getting an excellent remedy plan in place so as to know why we’re gonna begin right here and go there and go there. And so after I was doing all of these early, type of items of labor with you, it’s, it’s truly there, it’s twofold. One is, I truly, I’m, I’m purposefully mapping, I’m purposefully providing you with instruments that matter on your expertise of being within the work, however I’m additionally looking forward to very, very key facets that point out your mind is prepared to do that, that your nervous system can do sure issues.

(30:28)
And so every thing I’m doing has a twin objective. It’s each getting you prepared, constructing that readiness if I must do extra of one thing, but in addition seeing what’s there and seeing whether or not or not that that extra type of prep work is prepared. After which the opposite piece, and that is, that is simply because I need to point out it, that piece about that grownup, like strongest wisest self being there for little you, that’s the core key function to attachment restore. It’s growing out that grownup self to present little you what nobody else has been in a position to give us absolutely and to attract from the fashions of those that have possibly in items and issues like that. However finally, repairing the attachment system is realizing deep down that you simply’ve acquired you and that you simply’ve

Betty Rocker (31:19):

Acquired you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That’s so Properly, that’s so nicely stated. And, and this work is so profound as a result of I believe, our tradition just isn’t alone in being one which has a number of addictive compulsive sort of points, but it surely definitely has so many, and, and I believe this should be one thing that presents in, in your observe so usually is habit sort of labor. Mm-hmm . Like so many individuals, I imply, now we have habit to purchasing, to alcohol, to medicine, to intercourse, to, how, I don’t know, so many alternative issues. So I’d think about that EMDR is admittedly helpful in supporting the discount of addictive conduct. And and the way does it try this particularly? I,

Susie Morgan (32:07):

Properly, one of the vital current type of essential items of type of connecting the dots that’s been made got here by means of the ACEs examine. And I’m undecided should you or your listeners are aware of it, but it surely’s the opposed Childhood Experiences examine. And like EMDR, it’s truly been round for nearly as a lot time, but it surely didn’t actually get any press till extra just lately. However it’s a very fundamental examine that has simply been achieved on monumental hoards of individuals at this level. And it’s even, replicated by the, the CDC at this level. So we’re in a position to see it’s true throughout populations that early childhood opposed experiences, even when they occur simply as soon as, they create a vulnerability within the nervous system to develop psychological well being points, to develop bodily well being points and to develop addictions. And so, and it’s exponentially extra highly effective than anybody would ever assume.

(33:03)
And so addictions is one thing that we very a lot can see. Early childhood trauma actually potentiates that vulnerability to habit later. And what’s fascinating when it comes to EMDR remedy and trauma reminiscence networks and all of that’s this concept that habit has actually two elements which might be occurring with reminiscence networks. One is the trauma is a driver, in order that that ache goes to drive you to the factor that eases the ache. The opposite factor although, is the pull of the habit. And you may even have maladaptively linked constructive recollections which might be the, the important thing to the mind persevering with to hunt the excessive or the necessity being met by this addictive conduct or substance, even when there’s tons and tons of penalties, or should you by no means obtain that prime to that diploma. Once more,

Betty Rocker (33:58):

I virtually perceive what you imply by constructive maladaptive. It’s virtually prefer it, are you able to simply make clear that somewhat bit extra? Yeah,

Susie Morgan (34:06):

Yeah, completely. So the instance I discovered from the one who I first discovered this from, was an instance of the, you recognize, a somewhat, somewhat boy who had an abusive father. And his dad was actually, actually into taking part in playing cards, was actually into poker. And and afterward, this man has now could be now presenting in remedy as a result of he has a playing habit. He’s misplaced his home, he’s misplaced his household, he’s misplaced every thing. So we’re gonna assume, okay, nicely, he discovered about, he discovered about playing from little, in order that’s simply what he grew as much as do, proper? Like, it’s that straightforward, but it surely’s not, the place it truly solidified in his mind was, so keep in mind he has this trauma of neglect and, and abuse from his dad. Properly, someday, you recognize, one of many guys isn’t there for the poker sport. So dad invitations his son to the poker desk that’s the place his mind abruptly felt cherished. His mind abruptly felt seen and included and seen by his dad. And fireworks go off within the mind. And it’s like that soldering of one thing the place it’s identical to, Ooh, poker equals I’m cherished, I’m lovable. And so from then on, doesn’t matter how a lot he loses, doesn’t matter all the results, the mind doesn’t even like take note of any of that knowledge. It’s coming, but it surely doesn’t matter. He retains searching for that have to be met on the poker desk at no matter value.

Betty Rocker (35:45):

Acquired it. Acquired it. That’s an awesome instance, proper? That made a lot sense. You’ll be able to see how addictions can type of so many differing kinds due to the complexity of that layer, these layers collectively. Like that’s, and that should be very laborious to unwind for individuals due to what a strong urge that’s, like at a deep core degree to be cherished, to be belong. These are deep human wants that all of us have, and after they’re not met, once we’re youthful, after which they’ve these layers on prime of them, and we’re simply on the market making an attempt to be grownups, coping with life and all of our many duties and, and repeating outdated patterns time and again and never understanding why, as an example. So who wants EMDR? Who can be an excellent candidate for EMDR, would you say? I imply, we’ve talked about a number of issues, however I believe lots of people listening are figuring out sure issues in what we’re speaking about. So let’s simply make it plain and easy. Like who can be an excellent candidate?

Susie Morgan (36:46):

I suppose there’s somebody on the market who wouldn’t, however I haven’t met them. And, I imply, there are these individuals who actually grew up with that actually sturdy early attachment expertise. Their wants had been met. And, and I’ve seen these purchasers are available as a result of they’d one single actually unhealthy t like huge T trauma, and but their stuff resolves like that. Like that’s the place you see this like magic occur. Prefer it’s, it may be a matter of two classes and one thing horrific, identical to is is absolutely reprocessed by the nervous system

Betty Rocker (37:24):

As a result of they’ve a strong and safe attachment fashion and safety in themselves to begin with. Their basis is, is admittedly robust. After which from there, therapeutic is less complicated, I suppose you’ll say, proper?

Susie Morgan (37:37):

Sure. In order that they’re confronted with traumas, they’re confronted with various things, and their mind is like, oh, I’ve acquired this. And it, and it, it, you recognize, it takes that, that adaptive info reminiscence community and simply wraps it round and it’s identical to, yep. Like I discovered from that. Now it’s over and off you go. Hmm. So there are individuals on the market who’re like that, they’re simply extra uncommon.

(38:00)
Hmm. The remainder of us , and I say that together with myself, have much more vulnerability to those various things. And so when somebody is saying, you recognize, I’ve simply at all times been anxious, or I’ve simply at all times had these bouts of despair, that type of factor, or this self-doubt, this self-confidence subject the place I’m not reaching for that subsequent degree at work, or I’m not stepping out of, you recognize, like I, I do know I ought to be capable of do that, however I, however I’m, I’m stopping myself. I’m, I’m insecure, or I’m, you recognize, repeating these relationship patterns or that type of factor. Mm-hmm. All of this stuff are issues that make you an excellent candidate to step into an EMDR therapist’s workplace. Mm mm Then the distinction is whether or not or not that EMDR therapist has eyes to see learn how to deal with you. Have they achieved enough coaching in with the ability to actually, actually like, have that curiosity to, to have a look at what, what’s all this linked to? The place did this, this studying happen that’s now left you in a sample of, you recognize, responding on this method? What are all these reminiscence networks? And is your mind able to do the precise trauma reminiscence reprocessing, or do we have to do a bunch of fro entrance loading in order that we will get there? It’s oftentimes not the case that somebody can’t do EMDR remedy. It simply means somebody may must do some extra subtle issues to get their mind prepared for it.

Betty Rocker (39:30):

You will have some fairly superb sources for individuals at totally different ranges in terms of EMDR. One factor that you’ve got is, I keep in mind the EMDR readiness course, which helps individuals like me determine whether or not we’re prepared or how, clarify that for me, should you don’t thoughts.

Susie Morgan (39:50):

So this course has been round for quite a lot of years, and it’s truly, I’d attribute, the triggering of making that course to you truly, oh, cease . As a result of someday you sat down with me and also you stated, Susie, I’m referring individuals out to EMDR remedy on a regular basis now, they usually’re not getting, from their remedy course of what I’m getting with you. And at that time, it precipitated me to self-reflect and say, am I truly doing one thing in a different way? Hmm. And, and I discovered I used to be, and it wasn’t simply because I’m sensible, it was often because I used to be actually hungry to study and insecure. Truly, my very own insecurities had been in there the place I used to be like, I must study extra, I must study extra. I must study extra. So I had, I had gone to so many alternative trainings by so many alternative consultants within the discipline, however then my, my power actually is synthesizing issues collectively, curating and synthesizing these supplies right into a system primarily.

(40:48)
And so through the years, there’s been a technique that I’ve developed that began with that course and actually beginning to actually like, type of, conceptualize it and make it extra concrete that’s now developed out into some broader coaching applications that I can clarify. However, however the readiness course continues to be obtainable. It’s one thing that you are able to do by yourself. It’s virtually like a, a digital like workbook. And it takes you thru the readiness course of. So a number of the steps that you simply and I did collectively when it comes to these, these instruments and people, these expertise that you simply developed at first, beginning to actually map out these trauma reminiscence networks so as to actually do some work by yourself and determine does this EMDR remedy factor is sensible for me? Hmm. The opposite factor is that may be achieved alongside a therapist, of their course of with you.

(41:40)
For lots of people, it’s actually useful to have the help of a therapist whereas they’re doing these processes. And the primary module of that course says takes you thru some questionnaire that say like, ought to, must you do that alone or not? Hmm. And so it, it may possibly provide help to assume by means of that course of. The opposite factor that’s now obtainable, that’s additionally on the self-help web page of my web site, which is precisionemdr.com. So should you go to the self-help web page, you’ll see two various things. One is that readiness course, however one can be a free 45 minute course that truly explains this, this tree idea that we’ve been speaking about. Cool. So that you’re in a position to visualize the trauma reminiscence networks, that adaptive info mild tree of knowledge, in order that should you begin EMDR remedy, you’re getting into actually understanding that complete formulation of it. And it goes extra into what processing seems to be like, that type of factor and what’s taking place within the mind throughout that. So, so that’s free to only check out, there’s, no strings. Yeah.

Betty Rocker (42:45):

That’s an incredible present. And what an incredible useful resource as nicely. After which I believe you might be additionally now, such as you’ve stated, you’ve developed your methodology, you’re now coaching different therapists at totally different, totally different ranges from the graduate degree to all the way in which to individuals who’ve been training for a very long time. Is that what you had been telling me? That’s superb. What, what does that contain?

Susie Morgan (43:08):

So there’s two main items. One is now we have an EMDRIA accepted fundamental coaching, which they’re the bigwigs. They, they, they take you thru a reasonably rigorous course of whenever you’re growing a program to say, does it, you recognize, test all of the containers. And so we checked all of the containers and what was actually thrilling is, I used to be accepted to have the ability to, to actually use all of this readiness and the goal sequencing, which is the, the why you do, which, which trauma reminiscence first, that type of factor. In addition to all of those attachment items into our fundamental coaching program. After which now we have additionally a complicated a set of programs. So it’s truly a complete of 33 hours, half one and half two. However half one truly goes by means of all of this readiness and, and fills within the gaps of what hasn’t been there in a number of that conventional coaching that almost all therapists have gone by means of. After which half two goes into all of this fancy footwork round how will we restore the attachment system? How will we deal with these addictions? And that sparkle that these maladaptively linked recollections can have and all of that. So it’s, it’s a very sturdy superior course that individuals can undergo

Betty Rocker (44:20):

A lot to know, so essential to be a well-trained practitioner and for us as individuals searching for remedy to know as a lot as we will about this in order that we will go into it eyes open, searching for this care. And in addition, you recognize, discern being discerning, I suppose, about what we’re gonna obtain. I believe that’s, that’s so essential. Properly, you’ve shared your, web site with us and we will additionally observe you on social media, right. Wanna say your, your deal with,

Susie Morgan (44:55):

It’s @PrecisionEMDR. So it’s precisionEMDR all over the place. So whether or not that’s the web site or the deal with on Instagram or Fb, that’s, that’s the place yow will discover me and discover out what we’re doing. ’trigger I, it’s not simply me, however I even have gathered an exceptional staff of consultants. It’s truly one of many distinctive items of our program is everybody who’s a marketing consultant on our coaching staff is an knowledgeable in EMDR, in addition to oftentimes a specialty space or integration with one other remedy mannequin. So, so we will all be discovered there and it’s, it’s actually hopefully going to be increasingly a strong useful resource for referral sources and all of that for individuals everywhere in the, everywhere in the nation. As a result of now we have people who find themselves going by means of our trainings who’re from all over.

Betty Rocker (45:42):

That’s fantastic and fantastic to consider the entire people who find themselves probably searching for EMDR or possibly didn’t know the way helpful EMDR might be for them. And now we’ll have a further useful resource to return to for details about it, for searching for a practitioner for it, or practitioner searching for extra coaching for it. It’s actually fantastic what you might be creating. And thanks for all of the work that you simply do on this world to make it a greater place. We respect you a lot. So thanks. Thanks a lot for approaching and speaking to us immediately and sharing all of this actually helpful info and insights. And thanks for every thing you’ve achieved for me as nicely. Like, I’d not be this model of the Betty Rocker with out you and all your nice work. So all of you guys listening, I’m so glad that you simply had an opportunity to satisfy Susie, ’trigger she’s simply unbelievable and I hope you look her up and lookup her work. And Susie, is there any, like, final phrases, something you wanna depart with us that I didn’t ask or something you wanna say?

Susie Morgan (46:37):

Actually, it’s simply wanting to specific my gratefulness for the chance to return in right here and speak about this and, and the, the, the platform that you’re utilizing throughout the board to help, particularly girls of their well being on all facets of issues. And EMDR is one thing that, such as you stated, it’s a buzzword on the market. Individuals speak about it, however they oftentimes don’t know sufficient about it to grasp the way it might truly connect with them, the way it might truly be, actually possibly much more powerfully achieved if it’s one thing that they’d a, you recognize, eh, expertise with earlier than. Issues like that. So I’m simply actually grateful that this was essential to you to do and, and simply thanks for having me.

Betty Rocker (47:22):

Yay. Properly, we sit up for speaking to you once more very quickly. And, thanks guys a lot for listening. Yow will discover the entire hyperlinks and sources over on the present notes web page for this podcast episode, in addition to Susie’s hyperlinks that she’s already shared. So sit up for speaking to you once more. Until subsequent time, I’m Betty Rocker, and you might be so superior, so flawsome and superb.